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Thread: Legal Expenses

  1. #181
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    The point of the absences is not whether they are allowed by law and excused or unexcused, the point is that you can't say that the school is at fault for your child not learning when the child has that much time out of school.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but in 2011, your child missed 65 days or parts of days, in 2012, your child missed 117 days or parts of days, in summer school which is 12 days, she missed 6 days or parts of days, and the year you put her in private school, she was enrolled for 52 days and she was absent for 37 days or parts of days.

    I scanned some of your comments on one of those blogs and you disagree with the absences since you disagree with what is a tardy and what is an absence. Well, those standards apply to every student, not just yours.


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  3. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by siamcat View Post
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    I don't think the district should pay for private school, sorry Lan, but this shows the problem with SPED in Killeen and it's the bean counters and admin.
    Mrs. Carter's child received seven evaluations and eight ARD's in two years, that's four times more than is required which means four other kids could have been helped in the time the district took to help one. That is the heart of the problem when those who make the most noise get the most attention.

    Maybe the KDH would like to make that point this Sunday...but I doubt they will.


  4. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick View Post
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    Mrs. Carter's child received seven evaluations and eight ARD's in two years, that's four times more than is required which means four other kids could have been helped in the time the district took to help one. That is the heart of the problem when those who make the most noise get the most attention.

    Maybe the KDH would like to make that point this Sunday...but I doubt they will.
    Unless the rules have changed a parent can request an ARD at any time to discuss changes in the IEP. Teachers can too. The system can be confusing to those not familiar with it and I wish that there was more transparency and more information to inform the laymen parent.

    The other kids still received their ARDS, it's not an either/or.

    If you thought that your child didn't receive the proper services would you sit by quietly or make some noise? Me, I would make some noise.

    Lucky for me my kids had understanding teachers and most issues were solved privately between their teachers and me.

    I'm not blaming Lan or any other parent for standing up for their kid. These issues need to come to light and hopefully things will improve for all.

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  6. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by siamcat View Post
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    Unless the rules have changed a parent can request an ARD at any time to discuss changes in the IEP. Teachers can too. The system can be confusing to those not familiar with it and I wish that there was more transparency and more information to inform the laymen parent.

    The other kids still received their ARDS, it's not an either/or.

    If you thought that your child didn't receive the proper services would you sit by quietly or make some noise? Me, I would make some noise.

    Lucky for me my kids had understanding teachers and most issues were solved privately between their teachers and me.

    I'm not blaming Lan or any other parent for standing up for their kid. These issues need to come to light and hopefully things will improve for all.
    the only time i blame Lan is when I feel her hand in my pocket.....and right now, i have a feeling like someone's in there.....mac

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  8. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by siamcat View Post
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    Unless the rules have changed a parent can request an ARD at any time to discuss changes in the IEP. Teachers can too. The system can be confusing to those not familiar with it and I wish that there was more transparency and more information to inform the laymen parent.


    The other kids still received their ARDS, it's not an either/or.
    Obviously, they can do more than the required number. But the gist of the KDH attack is that there isn't time to do what is required and I'm sorry that you don't see that when resources are focused on the parents who will sue have a tendency to at the drop of a hat, then others can't be taken care of in a timely manner.


    If you thought that your child didn't receive the proper services would you sit by quietly or make some noise? Me, I would make some noise.
    But if it were your fault for not having the kid in school, I think you'd be sensible enough to see that and not blame the district for something that is not in their control.

    Lucky for me my kids had understanding teachers and most issues were solved privately between their teachers and me.
    Things change when lawsuits are threatened. A congenial relationship between parents and teachers tend to become more adversarial. It doesn't take an expert to know that.


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  10. #186
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    Well, it sort of smacks like just going back to your mom and dad and asking over and over again after being told no a hundred times.

    Face it, there are just some folks that will keep on plugging away till they get what they want....

    And part of the reason, from what I can see, for the backlog on designating and categorizing students is that there are just way more parents who have already made up their minds that their kid should be included... No matter what the system may say. I can see where they might get swamped.

    And if you add to the number the folks who didn't get what they wanted that keep returning, it can be a bit too much for any system.

    Sort of reminds me of the backlog of court cases.
    We have met the enemy and he is us... POGO

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  12. #187
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    One thing is for sure, it's a complex issue.

  13. #188
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    Some just can't no for an answer. Once they decide they can't get what they want they hire a lawyer and then demand the taxpayer pay their tab. If the parents had to pay lawyer fees, regardless of the outcome, there would be far fewer deadbeats with their hand out.
    TEXAS has a balanced budget.

    Jesus Saves, even Agnostics.

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  14. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
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    the only time i blame Lan is when I feel her hand in my pocket.....and right now, i have a feeling like someone's in there.....mac
    How do you know it's Lan and not the democratic party?
    "My days of not taking you seriously have come to a middle."
    ~ Captain Malcolm Reynolds

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  16. #190
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    There is an assumption that school is the best place for a student to be no matter what. If a student has a learning disability and the disability is not recognized to the end that it is not addressed, then the child may not be able to function in that environment. This does not mean the child should be taken away from the environment--but it does mean that things have to be done to factor the disability in to the teacher's planning and management of the class.

    There are some teachers who are observant and knowledgable about much more than their curriculum and they are attuned to things students need. Students might thrive in their class because the teacher is trying new things and managing the situation based on observations. This kind of teacher likes to prevent potential problems. This kind of teacher will most likely do the necessary thing even without an IEP...but there are many things that one doesn't know that would help teacher and students survive in the environment together.

    There is another kind of teacher that is skilled as well, but maybe doesn't know about certain disabilities or does not have any experience yet with what works best. That teacher handles kids pretty much the same without regard for what a child needs and he/she might need to be told that they must do certain things for certain children to be successful.

    Even for teacher one, it takes time to observe students and interact with them to figure out what to do. With teacher two, it takes longer. For me, IEPs give me that information on day 1 and I can make the most of my classroom management decisions and my instruction plans right from the start.

    Examples:
    Student is autistic. Student is very smart and benefits from classroom instruction and is indeed learning and contributing to groups that he works with. Student does have things that set him off and he does give warning signs, such as drumming the desk when he feels challenged or frustrated. Teacher doesn't know his tells, and one day ends up with him melting down and scaring everyone in class. She had no idea he was as frustrated as he was. The explosion can't be undone or unseen, but it was totally preventable. Let's change the decision a little and let's say that teacher was given his information and told that he does certain things when he gets frustrated, and is also told what frustrates him. She can be observant while she monitors groups. She looks back at the table and sees him quiet but drumming the table, so teacher moves in, gives other students an alternate task and then finds out what has happened. She finds out that he was doing something and he wanted to finish it himself but another student wanted to "help him" and that frustrated him. Explosion is averted because the situation was prevented.

    Another situation---student is autistic and change freaks him out. Teacher doesn't know this--he's in a Pre AP class because he is high functioning and very intelligent in her subject but she also sees him as quiet and shy and moves him around when she need to change seating because he looks like the easiest to move. Child becomes anxious and begins to act out. If the teacher knew his disability and accommodations she might do things differently. She might change the others instead of changing him...or she might talk to him about changes and why they must be made before she changes him so he can prepare for it.

    Yet another situation: Student comes from another school. Teacher puts student in open seat. The aisle is facing his left. During the course of the week, he is talking and she tries to redirect him. He doesn't respond when she walks up to him and tells him what to do in a normal voice. She raises her voice and now responds with consequence for insubordination because she thinks he's ignoring her intentionally. What she doesn't know is that he is hearing impaired and he can't hear in his left ear. She can't see his hearing aid because of his haircut and he looks otherwise normal. He's on grade level and even a very good student, so he is learning. Had she known through 504 plan that he's deaf in one ear, she could have seated him where his right ear was facing her, and she could approach him and touch him on his arm to get him to face her before she gave him redirection--she would then know he needs that to be fully aware of her communication.

    ___________________________

    The laws that have gotten outrageous have been made because students who were capable of learning were not getting equal and reasonable treatment in the classroom. They might have some teachers who clued in to their needs but they had some teachers who didn't, so laws were made to protect them. These are not throw-away people and they can and do go on to be productive members of society. Some of them have incredible skills in other areas that developed because of compensation for what they lacked due to disability. Case in point--I know of someone who works with a number of autistic people--government agency--their disability is very obvious but they have the ability to hyper focus on certain things with precision and accuracy that drives their more "normal" coworkers nuts. These individuals are helping to maintain national security. Who would have thought?

    The other thought I have on this---not every class or school environment is beneficial for a student. Students without disabilities might show more resilience, but when a parent notices the negative impact on their child, therapy might be the right course of action. We pull students out of classes for speech therapy, for example. If the school would recognize the disability then the services might be available in the school setting--but if the school won't recognize it, is the parent a bad parent because they do what they think is best by pulling the child from the school setting to get the therapy? I have seen kids so traumatized in a chaotic classroom that I do believe that there are times when the child is not being served well in that environment and I wish someone would intervene for the child. Quite often people don't and the child suffers. Now, in my room, they would do well, but they would not do well in the next teacher's room. I teach middle school and in past years I have had teachers come to me saying that they have students that they want to insure get in my class because I am known for maintaining a very structured and consistent environment. Not all teachers are equal and not all classes are the same--some teachers are very entertaining and gregarious and other teachers are very structured and predictable---and, unfortunately, there is no test for student placement--most of the time students get who they get, whether it is the best for them or not.

    Final thought---no one is listening to the teacher on some of these things. I am currently ignored and placated on some very important issues with my students because of very insane and illogical ways of thinking. Quite often I see the needs of many sacrificed because of incompetence or because of fear of parents...or many other things. I do speak up and it is often to my hurt, but I can't overlook things that I see. Even so, I can be very easily shut down. That is how our system works and it protects the larger organization at the expense of the very people it is supposed to serve. I wish the parents would step in but often they don't because they are either too busy, afraid, or lack the confidence to do so. This situation is also not good for the almighty taxpayer, of which I am one--because it limits the future productivity of those who should be entering the work force.

    It has long been my opinion here that many would rather pay to incarcerate people than educate them. You ARE going to pay for them in one way or the other. I see what happens with many low performing kids---teenage pregnancy, life on drugs, welfare, incarceration. What are you willing to pay for? I'd rather educate them than incarcerate them or support them on a life of welfare.
    Last edited by Yve; October 17th, 2015 at 7:43 PM.
    “All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.”Edmund Burke
    “In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends.”Martin Luther King, Jr.

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